Transcript
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Welcome to in behalf of Animals, I'm Nicole Arcello.
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Before we dive into today's conversation, I just wanted
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to take a moment to thank you all for the incredible outpouring
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of support following our first episode. Your messages,
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shares and reviews mean the world to us, and we're so
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grateful that you're here standing with us in
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the fight for animal liberation. Today, I'm excited
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to introduce the first of many guests,
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Jody Whitaker. Jody's journey is
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a powerful example of what can be achieved with determination
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and relentless advocacy for those who have no voice.
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Our conversation focuses on the cruelty of the horse carriage
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industry, but we also talk about two other urgent
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animal issues, individual animals who need our help
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right now. Whether you're looking for ways to
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fit advocacy into your busy schedule or you're ready
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to deepen your commitment, Jodi offers practical,
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inspiring advice on how you could take meaningful action.
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Starting today, we've included some steps you can take immediately
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in the show notes, along with more information about Jodi
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and her organizations, and you can find more on our website in
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behalf of animals.org, on our blog. By the end
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of this episode, you will feel motivated and empowered.
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So let's jump in with Jodi now.
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Jody, welcome to in behalf of Animals.
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Thank you very much. Thanks for your interest in talking to me.
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I'm so excited for you to be here, and I'm sure you'll be
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back quite a bit. So just so you know,
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you're a tireless activist. You have multiple organizations,
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multiple campaigns, daily actions for people to
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take for animals, and a weekly radio show about animal issues.
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And we'll get to some of that. That's a lot. But today
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we are talking mostly about horse carriages.
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So I want to start out by asking you to take us
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through a typical day in the life of a horse
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who is used for carriage rides.
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Well, obviously, some cities are different than others,
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but I'll tell you what I know about Chicago, and I think
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this would be comparable to many major cities.
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But in Chicago, there were laws on the books to protect the horses and
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the public. And one of the laws were was how long the
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horses could work. And that law was that they could only work 6 hours in
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a 24 hours period. And what we started documenting in August
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of 2017 is that the horses would arrive at
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the horse carriage stand downtown Chicago in the middle of Michigan
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Avenue, traffic and pedestrians and tourists,
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approximately 930 10:00 a.m. on weekends.
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And so we would document they arrived.
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And what we found is that they were working these horses more than 12
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hours more than double what Chicago's law allowed.
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So, and another thing we witnessed is not
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only were they breaking that law, but they were rarely providing water.
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The reason for that, we believe, is that they didn't want them
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urinating on the street. There were laws, if they urinated on
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the street, that the carriage operator had stopped the carriage
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and pour down a soapy solution.
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And so they didn't want them urinating.
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So they were rarely given water. And we documented this a
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lot and proved this to the city and
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they were actually cited and fined. So imagine being a
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thousand plus pound horse in a major city.
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Chicago's the third largest city in the United States. You are
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forced to trot from your
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stable, which is basically a cage, just bigger than a cage.
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A stall is just bigger than a horse. So it's like a cage for a
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horse a good half hour or so to get to the carriage stand,
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and then you are either standing around or giving rides,
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forced to pull carriage and people around all day
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for more than 12 hours. And youre around
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motorcycles and emergency vehicles and
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bus, city buses and garbage trucks and
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a lot of pedestrians. And horses are prey animals.
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They're 1000 plus pound prey animals who spook easily
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and they're in this very loud urban environment.
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So those are just some of the things that we know these
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horses go through. And then after working a twelve plus hour day,
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they go back to a cage where they, we don't even
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know if they could lie down comfortably at all or at
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all. They had no turnout in Chicago, there was no law regarding
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turnout, which would allow them to be in grass or pasture
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where they could run, play with others,
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lie down, roll in the grass. There was no requirement
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for that in Chicago. And I know many other major cities,
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horses have a similar fate where after working
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on the streets all day, they go back into a dingy warehouse
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without grass under their feet, without being able to stretch,
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without being free from this exploitation.
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It's really awful. And I think a lot of people don't. Maybe people
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aren't aware of this issue because maybe there isn't
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horse carriages in their city and they're not seeing it. But when they travel,
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they definitely see this and they think it's this romantic,
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you know, thing to do. What happens to
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the horses after this industry is done with them? I'm sure they're
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too slow. And in their minds, the horses,
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you know, they're not, they're useless. They're not money makers anymore. What do they do?
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Well, as you know well, and many people who work in animal advocacy.
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Know that when horses can no longer provide
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a profit for their owners, there is no use for them.
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There is no money put into a horse if
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they are lame or if they break a lamb, there's no money put
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into these horses. So I don't have statistics on Chicago's
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carriage horses, but it's very likely that they
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end up being dumped in kill pens or possibly sent overseas
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to be slaughtered for meat. Again, there is,
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when we work on bands around the world, the pro
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horse carriage industry will say to us, well, if they don't have a job,
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well, then they're going to go to slaughter or they're going to, you know,
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nothing good. They'll go to the glue factory. They'll say, so we
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say, our response to that is, if they don't
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have a job and they. You're going to send them to the glue factory,
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what happens when they're too lame and too old to pull a carriage?
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What happens then? Do you. Because they always say, well,
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there's no money if they're not pulling a carriage. Well, then where's the money
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to care for the old horses or the lame horses when,
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when they, they can't do the job anymore. So we
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know as activists that, and we'll, we'll tell everybody this,
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we will find homes for these horses when we get banned.
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However, at the end of the day, these horses are owned animals. Unfortunately,
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horse animals are property. So if the
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horses do end up going to a kill pen or being
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slaughtered, that is on the owners, we have offered
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homes. We will always work with the owners of these horse
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carriage companies to find homes, rescues,
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sanctuaries or the horses, we will raise the
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money to do so. But at the end of the day, if the owners are
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not willing to work with animal advocates, are not willing to allow these
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horses to go to sanctuaries or rescues,
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and they end up in a bad place that is completely on
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the owners, not on animal advocates. Right.
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It's always the same story. If they wouldn't, if they weren't, if we weren't
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abusing them, well, then they wouldn't exist.
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Right. But they're born into this. Yeah.
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So you had a groundbreaking victory in Chicago
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in April of 2020. Chicago City Council
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voted overwhelmingly, 46 to four. Is that right? To bandaid
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horse carriages in the city beginning under a year later,
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January 1. So that this is like victory on top of
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victory on top of victory. Usually these are phase outs that are a number of
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years. So that's the short story of it all. So tell
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us how you accomplished this in a very short period of time,
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too. Sure. Well, the Chicago lions for Animals
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formed in May of 2015, and there was a group of us that
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formed it together. And it was actually my suggestion that we.
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That horse care just be our first campaign, because it's
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kind of low hanging fruit. Obviously, big agriculture
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and animal experimentation are two issues
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I'd love to see go by the wayside, but those are gonna be harder.
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So we started doing monthly outreach down by the horse carriage stand.
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Very peaceful, friendly outreach, where we held signs,
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handed out flyers, ask people to sign our in person petition,
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give us testimony, video testimonials about why they would
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like to see horse carriages banned in Chicago. And we did this for
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about two years. And we also reached out to the mayor's office.
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We reached out to aldermen, the two aldermen where the horses worked
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and were stabled. We could not get a meeting with them because we were not
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their constituents. The mayor's office refused to respond to us,
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ever. And so my good friend and volunteer,
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Barbara Whelan Krantz, who I called my right hand woman,
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she and I were in Washington, DC, at the National Animal Rights conference,
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and it was kind of a slow time. We were sitting at our booth,
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and we were just discussing the campaign,
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and we decided we have to pick our game up.
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Our monthly outreach and trying to get meetings with the officials was
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just not cutting it. And we decided right then and there,
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we picked a date in August when we got home, and we were going to
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go down the horse carriage stand very early and
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document when the horses arrived. And we read up on
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all of Chicago's laws and regulations regarding the trade.
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And what we realized was Chicago's laws were pretty
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progressive compared to other cities. For example,
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in Chicago, the temperature they could work at, they could not work
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them above 90 degrees in the summer.
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In Dallas, Texas, that temperature is 100 degrees.
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So. But that doesn't mean they. They enforce the law.
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And so we went down, we documented that the horses were being
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overworked every single time they were out. They worked them when it was
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too hot. They worked them on streets. They weren't allowed.
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So there were laws on the books to protect the horses and also to
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protect the public, but none of those laws were being enforced.
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So by going down and documenting these violations and then
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sharing them with the mayor's office and the city council,
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we proved to them that the city agency that was tasked
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with enforcing these laws was a Monday through Friday,
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09:00 to 05:00 agency. They weren't down at the horse carriage stand on
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Saturdays and Sundays, when the horses were being overworked.
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They weren't down there on the 4 July when the horses were being worked in
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too hot of weather. So a combination of documenting the violations
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and then sharing those violations with the city council, doing what
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we started, and it all started in 2017.
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August 2017 is when we started documenting the horses and the
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violations. I believe it was October of 2017.
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I started what I called daily action alerts.
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Daas, where every day we would pick
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a target, say, one day would be the mayor of Chicago,
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the next day would be the first award, next day,
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second ward. And I provide all of the contact information for that
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official, and I urge everybody to take action one way.
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So either make one phone call, send one email, send a
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Facebook message, send a tweet, send an Instagram message,
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contact them through their website, and anybody can do
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these actions. Oh, I was just going to ask one little thing, just not to
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interrupt. But when you say everybody, were you posting these on social media?
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So people that weren't even in Chicago, we're taking action,
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or. Yes. Yes. Okay. Because it's a tourist industry.
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So what I tell people is you can simply
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tell them, you can say one sentence, please ban
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horse carriages in Chicago, or you can say your name, you can
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say, I live in Toronto and I love Chicago,
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but I'm not going to visit, I'm not going to spend my tourism dollars in
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Chicago until horses are no longer exploited on Chicago streets.
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So people can put as much time into these as they want.
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They can share a recent accident or fatality, or they
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can simply say one sentence. That's all it takes. And just
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by a one method, you know, one way of contacting them. And so
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I think between these. These daas documenting the violations,
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and then we started testifying before the city council, submitting public
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comment, and we did this every month for two years. Wow.
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We got the bill introduced in December of 2017
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because we showed the alderman where the horses work,
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all these violations, and we actually got on the
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agenda to be voted on in September of 2018.
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So just nine months after the bill was introduced,
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unfortunately, after a four and a half hour hearing, the chair of
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the committee blocked a vote. We had enough votes to pass it, and she blocked.
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So we just kept going, and we got it. The agenda,
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we had to wait until March of 2020 to get it heard again in
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the committee where it was sitting, the license committee. But then Covid
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hit. Covid literally hit the
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day we got it passed out of the committee unanimously.
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And that scared me to no end. Because I
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was so worried that the city council might feel
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sorry for the operators because they weren't
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being able to make a. Make any money because
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everything was shut down. Yeah. What a complication. Yeah.
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So one week after our, our agenda,
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it passed through the committee unanimously. It was supposed to go to
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the full city council for a vote, and we were
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sure it would pass, but it got delayed and because of
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COVID So luckily, we got it done in. That is.
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That is awesome. And then fast forward.
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So big victory. Biggest city
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in the US, right. That has. With a
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ban on horse carriages. And then fast forward
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to January 1. So what happened?
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Did it go smoothly or did you have to be there to make sure they
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were shut down? In all honesty,
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because of COVID they had that phase out from April till
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January 1 of 2021, but they weren't out
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hardly at all because of COVID They couldn't really work.
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You know, and obviously, my organization and
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every animal rights organization, our goal is not to put people out
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of work or to end small businesses.
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But when your business relies on
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animal exploitation or animal suffering to make a profit,
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then it's time to reevaluate your business and. And.
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And transition to something more humane.
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And that was our goal. And so January 1
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came along, and they were. They were just gone. And I would go
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down routinely to check. And, of course,
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I had all my Chicago volunteers on alert to
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let me know if. If they ever saw any horses working.
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Since that date, we have heard about a
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couple carriage rides, and it's illegal in any way,
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shape and form, not only as a tourist trade downtown,
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but they cannot be rented in the city for weddings,
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for, you know, for any events. And we were alerted to
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a couple. There was one on Halloween.
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Someone had rented one as, like, a Cinderella type
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Halloween costume. And, you know, we,
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we alerted this to the officials, but unless we can
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catch them in the act, it's kind of hard. But it's only happened a couple
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times. And we're, of course, we're keeping our
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eyes open, and we'll report it and urge the city to
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cite and find any operators who are breaking Chicago's law.
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So was that your idea, to put that in the legislation, to have no
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private use? It was actually horse carriage
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hire, I guess. I don't know how to say that, but it
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didn't work. Ideally, that is our goal.
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But the way the law was written was simply that there.
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Well, they took out the language in Chicago's code that
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all the language about horse carriage regulations, they just
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took it out. So there was no way anybody can drive
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or ride in a horse carriage in the city limits. Oh, that is
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amazing. It didn't even occur to me that for weddings or some,
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you know, or other events, that people could still try to do this.
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So that's. That's just amazing. So it really
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is a very progressive law here in Chicago compared to
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other cities that have passed them that still might allow for
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special events or. And. And parades and
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things like that. I just have to say, this is grassroots activism at its
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finest, because the activism
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works. You know, you and I can say that it does. We know that,
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you know, the Margaret Mead quote, a small group of people can change the world.
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And so. Okay, so now
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you have partnership to ban horse carriages worldwide,
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right? Yeah. So tell me about that.
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And I. So how many cities are you working in, in the US or
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across the country? Tell us about how many
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cities have horse carriage operations. Well, there are many cities
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that still have the horse carriage operations. I couldn't even
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gather a number, but unfortunately, there are a lot more than there are vans.
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But again, how. I said, everything formed started
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in 2017. That's when I formed the partnership. I think
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that was November of 2017. And I
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reached out to anybody and everybody I could around the world. If I
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could find a ban horse carriage page or anybody
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working on this, I reached out and said, hey, let's work together.
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Let's share campaign strategies. And one month
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later, we got a bill introduced. So our strategies were
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working. And so I have formed
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van horse carriages chapters throughout the world.
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I helped guide my Philly activists.
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I urged Stephanie Kirsten to take on this campaign.
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That's revolution Philadelphia. Yep. And she and Tiffany,
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who was running revolution Philadelphia, worked together,
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and they implemented a lot of CAA strategies,
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and they don't have a ban yet, but they got the horses off the street,
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so there are no horses working in Philly. And I
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hope that they do get a ban in place, because if
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New York City ever gets a ban, I worry that they might.
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Some of the operators or owners might try to transition to
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Philly or Boston or some of these other cities where
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Boston rarely has a presence. They were working
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to get a ban in Boston, too. But my
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Dallas partner, Gloria Raquel Carbajal, and my Savannah
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partners are really working hard. I really
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hope we can get Savannah and Dallas band by the end of this year.
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I'm also working with, like I said, Boston Charleston.
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I have a great volunteer there and an Indy
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who are working to on campaigns and implementing our strategies,
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such as the daAs, the 1 hour educational outreach
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a month testifying before city council documenting violations.
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And I just recently picked up a new volunteer in Vancouver
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and St. Augustine, Florida. Oh, that's awesome. And I have chapters
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in New York City, Krakow, Poland, Atlanta, New Orleans.
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And I'm always looking for volunteers to help me in
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those cities. And keep in mind that when we worked on our
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campaign in Chicago, none of us got paid. We all worked full time.
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We did it when we could, and we didn't
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have one serious. We didn't have any accidents or fatalities during
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our campaign. Now, obviously, an accident or fatality
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will help ban horse carriages, but nobody wants that. Nobody wants
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to see a horse collapse or humans rush to the ER.
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So you can do this. Anybody can do this in their city.
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And I recommend putting in 1 hour a week. There's 24 hours
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in a day. Anybody can put in 1 hour a week. Yeah,
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there's always pockets of time in the day. And that's what our podcast is about,
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is being voiced for the animals every chance you get. And you're all about that
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with your daily, your daily action DaA.
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Daily action alerts. That's right. Yeah. Can you speak
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to what happened in New York City at all? I know one of Mayor
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de Blasio's campaign promises was to do away with horse carriages
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in a city as big as New York. Maybe there was
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political aspects that affected the campaign,
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whether celebrities or prominent people instrumental
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in defeating the initiative. I mean, I know this has been ongoing for
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a lot of years, so, you know, can you talk about that a little bit?
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Sure. The whole New York City issue makes me incredibly sad.
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Obviously, their trade is bigger than any city.
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It's. It was a lot bigger than Chicago's, however.
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And they're up against the unions and
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that's their biggest obstacle. However,
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I don't know how if they're documenting violations.
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I think that is key, is you've got to get out there.
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And from morning to night, we didn't want
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to do it. We spent multiple Saturdays getting to the horse carriage,
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Dan, at 839 in the morning, and we were still there at
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01:00 a.m. on Sunday morning documenting the violations and documenting
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the fact that this horse got here at nine and
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it's now 1230 at night. And we, we would narrate our videos
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and say, and that's. I mean, without the documenting of the
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violations, we would. We. The horses would still be downtown on Chicago streets.
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That is necessary in any city to prove
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that there are violations. And I will tell you, every city,
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every horse carriage operator violates the law, period.
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Yeah, absolutely. Whether it's overworking,
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not providing water, not providing breaks, going down streets,
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they don't belong. There are violations out there and
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they can be found, and that's critical to your campaign.
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I hope New York does it. I've helped. I have done everything I
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can to help New York City. I hope they're out
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documenting violations and then proving that to the mayor. Because some
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people have told me Chicago has such a progressive city council.
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You know, that's not why we got our ban. Chicago's city
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council is not an animal rights city council. Right.
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And the fact that we won 46 to four speaks
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volumes. It's not that they all loved horses.
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It's that we prove about the violations and the dangers.
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That's another aspect is to prove to every time there's a
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fatality or an accident, it doesn't matter where it happens,
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you share it with your officials because your officials will say to you,
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we don't want to hear from people outside New York City or
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outside whatever city you're working on. We don't want, we don't care that there was
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a fatality in New Orleans. Well, too bad. We're going to tell you
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about it because it doesn't matter where these things happen. It's the same
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industry. It's the same. Same settings.
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Busy. Yes, urban settings. So officials
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will always tell you they don't want to hear from you or they don't care
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that an accident happened in a city outside their jurisdiction.
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That's what officials do. They don't want to hear from the public.
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But we have every right to share that information and to keep that pressure
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on. So that's what I urge all anyone working
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on campaigns, whether it's forced care, just force racing animal
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circuses, is you have to constantly reach
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out to those officials and don't let them tell you, we don't
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want to hear from you. We don't want to hear from people, you know,
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anywhere. Everybody has a right to contact officials in support
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of animal welfare, animal protection and animal advocacy.
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That's right. Our officials need to know what we care
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about, and we need to tell them again and again and again. And they do
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have to listen. They have to mark it down. They have to listen.
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And you're right, they will give you pushback,
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but that squeaky wheel gets the grease. Right. And that's what it's all
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about. Exactly. And some advocates think that when
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an official tells them, oh, you know,
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if you have people contacting us who don't live in this town,
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we're not gonna pass a ban. That is a scare tactic.
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They're telling you that because they're sick of hearing, you know, getting 15
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2050 emails, phone calls, tweets,
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00:25:43,440 --> 00:25:46,400
Facebook messages a day. Do not let that stop you.
421
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I can't stress that enough. Right? Yes. And they will.
422
00:25:49,400 --> 00:25:53,224
They. They will do that. We just have to do something every single day.
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And sometimes it's a big something, like being out there at 01:00 a.m. right,
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and documenting. And that'll be for a short time. You know,
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that's when it's crunch time and you have to get all that.
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But then after that, it could be an hour a week or whatever.
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And. And we need people of all, you know, time dedications
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to do. To do these things. So sorry
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00:26:14,936 --> 00:26:18,688
to interrupt. I say that you
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00:26:18,704 --> 00:26:22,940
don't have to run the campaign to help if you are on Facebook or.
431
00:26:23,240 --> 00:26:25,780
Well, that's how I post my actions is on Facebook.
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If you're not, I urge you to be on, because Facebook is a great tool
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00:26:30,256 --> 00:26:33,568
for advocacy. But if you can know
434
00:26:33,584 --> 00:26:36,380
how to send an email, if you know how to make a phone call,
435
00:26:36,520 --> 00:26:39,964
you can take action. Because a lot of people might look at
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00:26:39,972 --> 00:26:43,484
my das because I provide a lot of information and they'll say,
437
00:26:43,612 --> 00:26:47,028
you know, that's overwhelming. I don't know how to do it. Again, if you
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00:26:47,044 --> 00:26:50,092
know how to make a phone call, send an email. If you're on
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00:26:50,116 --> 00:26:53,268
Facebook, you know how to comment on a post and you know how to
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00:26:53,324 --> 00:26:57,020
do the DAA because you can send a message to an official.
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00:26:57,180 --> 00:26:59,876
And again, it's one sentence. So where I say,
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00:26:59,908 --> 00:27:03,206
today's DAA is to urge the
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00:27:03,238 --> 00:27:06,702
mayor of St. Augustine to ban horse carriages. And then I provide her
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00:27:06,726 --> 00:27:09,982
phone number, her email address. So just make that call
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00:27:10,046 --> 00:27:13,510
and say, I'm urging the mayor to ban horse carriages.
446
00:27:13,670 --> 00:27:16,806
Thank you. Goodbye. It's that simple. And that's it.
447
00:27:16,878 --> 00:27:20,550
You don't have to be an expert. No. This is something that's so
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00:27:20,590 --> 00:27:24,446
important for our listeners to know, as we're all about
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00:27:24,558 --> 00:27:27,638
empowering people to fight for the animals,
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is you don't have to be an expert in any of this. So you're
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00:27:31,246 --> 00:27:34,774
listening today. You're learning about horse carriages. You may learn about
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00:27:34,942 --> 00:27:38,366
other. You will learn about other animal issues as you listen on,
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00:27:38,478 --> 00:27:41,286
but you don't have to be an expert. You don't have to read books about
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00:27:41,318 --> 00:27:43,910
it. You don't have to scour the Internet. You don't have to do your own
455
00:27:43,950 --> 00:27:47,454
research, because when we do actions like your daily action
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00:27:47,502 --> 00:27:50,998
alerts. Everything's there. There's a script, there's contact
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00:27:51,094 --> 00:27:54,478
information. You helped us form the horse racing
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00:27:54,534 --> 00:27:58,214
wrongs action group. And a lot of times what we do on there
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00:27:58,302 --> 00:28:01,978
is sometimes people say, oh, I don't know how to copy
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00:28:01,994 --> 00:28:05,218
and paste something. I say, then dm me your email
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00:28:05,274 --> 00:28:08,082
address and I copy it and throw it in an email because they can copy
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00:28:08,106 --> 00:28:11,762
and paste better out of, I don't care what I have to do extra.
463
00:28:11,906 --> 00:28:15,314
As long as they can, they can make it easier
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00:28:15,362 --> 00:28:18,458
for them. But we take every opportunity to make it easy.
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00:28:18,514 --> 00:28:20,898
And I think that's so, so important.
466
00:28:21,074 --> 00:28:24,506
Exactly. And I tell people, do what
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00:28:24,538 --> 00:28:27,714
you're comfortable with if you don't want to, if you don't want to
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00:28:27,762 --> 00:28:30,070
make the call because you're uncomfortable talking.
469
00:28:30,570 --> 00:28:34,130
Again, I always say Facebook messenger is the easiest. You just
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00:28:34,170 --> 00:28:38,146
click, I provide the link, you just click on it. Their page pulls
471
00:28:38,178 --> 00:28:41,762
up, you see message and you click message and you say, please ban horse
472
00:28:41,786 --> 00:28:45,810
carriages or email. And again, you don't
473
00:28:45,850 --> 00:28:48,386
have to be like, I love that you said, you don't have to be an
474
00:28:48,418 --> 00:28:51,310
expert. We are the ones providing the information.
475
00:28:51,920 --> 00:28:56,184
It literally is one sentence. So please ban horse racing. Please ban
476
00:28:56,232 --> 00:28:59,616
the sale of fur in Chicago. We're trying to ban the sale of fur here
477
00:28:59,648 --> 00:29:03,336
now, too. So what are, what else are you working on?
478
00:29:03,488 --> 00:29:07,040
Like right now? I know you have daily action alerts that could vary day to
479
00:29:07,080 --> 00:29:10,656
day from one end of the animal rights spectrum to the other and back
480
00:29:10,688 --> 00:29:13,928
and forth and in between. But what besides horse carriages,
481
00:29:13,984 --> 00:29:17,650
what? You mentioned fur band in Chicago. Yeah.
482
00:29:17,690 --> 00:29:21,506
What are we, we are trying to pass the bill
483
00:29:21,538 --> 00:29:25,282
to ban the sale of new per, in Chicago. We have 21 latest
484
00:29:25,346 --> 00:29:28,746
count, 21 co sponsors. There's 50 aldermen in Chicago.
485
00:29:28,778 --> 00:29:31,986
So we're almost halfway there. So if
486
00:29:32,018 --> 00:29:35,458
you're listening and you're a Chicago resident, we really need you
487
00:29:35,474 --> 00:29:38,898
to contact your city council member and urge them to sign on as
488
00:29:38,914 --> 00:29:41,930
a co sponsor. You don't even have to know the name of the bill.
489
00:29:42,090 --> 00:29:45,096
You could just say the bill to ban the sale of new fur in Chicago.
490
00:29:45,218 --> 00:29:48,660
If you are not a Chicago resident and you live anywhere else,
491
00:29:48,820 --> 00:29:52,636
please call either the mayor of Chicago or email Mayor
492
00:29:52,668 --> 00:29:56,284
Brandon Johnson or the 50th ward Alderperson,
493
00:29:56,332 --> 00:30:00,044
Deborah Silverstein. I don't have her contact info handling. We'll put it in the show
494
00:30:00,092 --> 00:30:03,100
notes so people can, I can definitely do that information. Yes,
495
00:30:03,220 --> 00:30:06,812
she is the chair of the license committee where
496
00:30:06,996 --> 00:30:10,596
this bill is sitting. And she was a co sponsor on the bill
497
00:30:10,628 --> 00:30:14,406
to ban horse carriages. And the bill that we helped passed
498
00:30:14,468 --> 00:30:18,482
to shut down the puppy mill stores in Chicago, which was another big success of
499
00:30:18,506 --> 00:30:21,746
ours. So she is compassionate individual.
500
00:30:21,858 --> 00:30:25,282
We just. She just needs a little extra pressure to get her to
501
00:30:25,386 --> 00:30:27,510
co sponsor and put it on the agenda.
502
00:30:28,970 --> 00:30:32,202
We are also working hard to pass to get
503
00:30:32,226 --> 00:30:35,914
the village of Lincoln Wood, which is basically the furthest
504
00:30:36,042 --> 00:30:39,866
northwest on the edge of Chicago. The first village,
505
00:30:40,018 --> 00:30:43,798
very tiny town, but they have two laws on
506
00:30:43,814 --> 00:30:48,190
their books. One, it prohibits the sale of wild animals,
507
00:30:48,350 --> 00:30:52,766
and the other law is a Cook county law that prohibits the sale of rabbits.
508
00:30:52,958 --> 00:30:56,110
They waive their own laws. They have not enforced
509
00:30:56,150 --> 00:30:59,782
the Cook county rabbit law for more than six years now.
510
00:30:59,926 --> 00:31:03,598
And meanwhile, an animal rescue that's only a
511
00:31:03,614 --> 00:31:06,894
couple miles east of the village here in
512
00:31:06,902 --> 00:31:10,202
Chicago is inundated with rabbits that people
513
00:31:10,266 --> 00:31:13,658
buy at from pet stores, from the pet store
514
00:31:13,714 --> 00:31:17,786
in Lincoln Wood called the animal store. And they dump them because they realize
515
00:31:17,898 --> 00:31:21,650
that rabbits are not an easy pet. They're considered an exotic
516
00:31:21,690 --> 00:31:24,790
animal, so they have to be taken to an exotic veterinarian.
517
00:31:25,250 --> 00:31:28,978
And every year, red door animal shelter
518
00:31:29,034 --> 00:31:32,770
keeps track. All the rabbits that they rescue, that. That are
519
00:31:32,810 --> 00:31:35,736
abandoned and that people dump.
520
00:31:35,888 --> 00:31:38,928
So every year, that number
521
00:31:38,984 --> 00:31:42,392
is around 1000 rabbits. Wow. And yet.
522
00:31:42,536 --> 00:31:46,552
And we've been testifying before Lehengenwood's board of trustees for
523
00:31:46,656 --> 00:31:49,800
more than two years now. We've told them every story about
524
00:31:49,840 --> 00:31:53,160
rabbits who have, you know, been dumped, rabbits that
525
00:31:53,240 --> 00:31:57,064
have lost limbs, and all of the horrible stories
526
00:31:57,152 --> 00:32:00,806
out there, and they. They are unmoved.
527
00:32:00,878 --> 00:32:04,702
It's unbelievable that they. And what's really sad is they seem to
528
00:32:04,726 --> 00:32:08,686
very. Be very progressive on social issues, like LGBTQ
529
00:32:08,758 --> 00:32:12,278
community and other cultures and religions. Yet when it
530
00:32:12,294 --> 00:32:15,210
comes to animals, they seem to be absolutely heartless.
531
00:32:16,630 --> 00:32:19,918
And on top of that spur, the tortoise is
532
00:32:19,974 --> 00:32:23,670
a huge sulcata tortoise who was stolen from Africa,
533
00:32:23,750 --> 00:32:27,190
stolen from her home and family, and plopped into a
534
00:32:27,230 --> 00:32:30,646
display case in the animal store in Lincoln Wood.
535
00:32:30,838 --> 00:32:34,854
This display case is approximately three by 5ft.
536
00:32:35,022 --> 00:32:38,582
She has nothing natural about her. Her life. She.
537
00:32:38,646 --> 00:32:42,582
All she has is hay and sometimes a heat lamp or
538
00:32:42,606 --> 00:32:46,414
a sunland, we're not sure which. She has nothing. She cannot
539
00:32:46,462 --> 00:32:49,662
burrow like sulcata tortoises like to do.
540
00:32:49,806 --> 00:32:52,710
She cannot roam. Sulcata tortoises are slow,
541
00:32:52,750 --> 00:32:55,892
but they like to roam for miles every day.
542
00:32:56,076 --> 00:32:59,700
And she is stuck in a display case to be used as
543
00:32:59,740 --> 00:33:03,100
a prop to get people to come into this store, and they waive
544
00:33:03,140 --> 00:33:05,840
their law. When we brought this to their attention in,
545
00:33:06,500 --> 00:33:10,252
it was march of 2022, they literally voted to
546
00:33:10,276 --> 00:33:14,316
waive their own law, and that is keeping her in a
547
00:33:14,348 --> 00:33:18,244
prison. And we have a sanctuary in Arizona where the temperature
548
00:33:18,292 --> 00:33:21,628
would be comparable. The climate and everything about it would
549
00:33:21,644 --> 00:33:24,838
be comparable to her home in Africa. The sanctuary
550
00:33:24,894 --> 00:33:27,590
will take her. It would cost the village nothing.
551
00:33:27,710 --> 00:33:32,130
Caa would transport her safely to Arizona.
552
00:33:32,630 --> 00:33:36,670
They don't care. So it's heartbreaking. But Caa
553
00:33:36,710 --> 00:33:40,622
will not stop until we get her to sanctuary and we
554
00:33:40,646 --> 00:33:44,406
get the village to enforce these humane laws that were proposed,
555
00:33:44,558 --> 00:33:48,270
passed, and put on the books for a reason. And the most important thing that
556
00:33:48,350 --> 00:33:51,788
I'm hearing you say is, you know,
557
00:33:51,884 --> 00:33:55,908
they're, they're not, they're not budging. They don't care. They care about other issues.
558
00:33:56,044 --> 00:33:59,932
But you're not stopping, because we will win
559
00:34:00,076 --> 00:34:02,972
for animals if we keep going. Animal,
560
00:34:03,156 --> 00:34:06,772
out of all the social justice movements,
561
00:34:06,876 --> 00:34:10,788
they're all slow. All of them. Animals are really slow.
562
00:34:10,844 --> 00:34:14,228
Animals can't stand up. They can't protest for themselves.
563
00:34:14,284 --> 00:34:17,726
They can't speak for themselves. And that's why we need to do it. We need
564
00:34:17,758 --> 00:34:21,606
more and more people to do it. So thank you for all of
565
00:34:21,638 --> 00:34:24,770
that and all of that extra education on,
566
00:34:25,110 --> 00:34:29,230
you know, sad and bad things that are happening. But also the inspiration that
567
00:34:29,270 --> 00:34:32,942
we can all do something for these animals every single day. And that's
568
00:34:32,966 --> 00:34:36,606
what keeps me going, too, is that I know I can do something every day
569
00:34:36,798 --> 00:34:40,342
because I can't sit still. I can't, you know, just like you, we're. We're so
570
00:34:40,366 --> 00:34:44,798
alike, and we can't just do nothing. So is
571
00:34:44,814 --> 00:34:47,502
there anything else? I want to get to a couple of our questions we like
572
00:34:47,526 --> 00:34:50,910
to ask everybody, but I am going to ask how people can get involved.
573
00:34:50,950 --> 00:34:54,310
We talked a little bit about that. Do you want to talk about that next,
574
00:34:54,350 --> 00:34:57,630
or do you have something else you wanted to add? We also
575
00:34:57,670 --> 00:35:00,910
are working for Rocky the coyote, who was found
576
00:35:00,990 --> 00:35:04,550
in the Carolinas as a pup. I believe his eyes were not even open.
577
00:35:04,670 --> 00:35:07,902
The people who found him brought him to a local animal shelter,
578
00:35:08,006 --> 00:35:11,944
and they realized that he was a coyote pupdenne. And somehow river trail
579
00:35:11,992 --> 00:35:15,552
nature center, which is in the Cook county forest preserves, got their hands
580
00:35:15,576 --> 00:35:18,968
on him. They locked him into a cage,
581
00:35:19,144 --> 00:35:22,780
and he's been there for more than six years or seven years now.
582
00:35:23,120 --> 00:35:26,552
He is a pack animal. He doesn't have a pack.
583
00:35:26,616 --> 00:35:29,920
He's all alone 24/7 you know,
584
00:35:30,000 --> 00:35:33,224
they call his handlers his pack. They'll go in
585
00:35:33,272 --> 00:35:36,868
and they treat him like a dog. And because he was. Was found as
586
00:35:36,884 --> 00:35:40,324
a pup and handled, he is like a dog. And he's very
587
00:35:40,372 --> 00:35:43,772
closely related to a dog. So he has this
588
00:35:43,836 --> 00:35:47,212
need to have socialism. He loves when his handlers
589
00:35:47,236 --> 00:35:50,452
come in and pet him and give him treats and play with him like
590
00:35:50,476 --> 00:35:54,356
a dog, but then they're gone. So he might have approximately
591
00:35:54,388 --> 00:35:58,076
a half hour a day with his handlers and then for 23
592
00:35:58,228 --> 00:36:02,270
or maybe an hour. Well, let's be generous. Give him an hour with his handlers,
593
00:36:02,380 --> 00:36:06,178
but for 23 hours, he's alone and he's a pack animal. And they may,
594
00:36:06,234 --> 00:36:10,122
they spent, I believe it was around $250,000
595
00:36:10,186 --> 00:36:14,338
of Cook county tax dollars. I'm a Cook county taxpayer,
596
00:36:14,514 --> 00:36:18,138
to expand his cage. So he's got a bigger cage.
597
00:36:18,274 --> 00:36:21,778
But they're not addressing the fact that he's all alone.
598
00:36:21,914 --> 00:36:25,634
Right. And in the winter, we have documented that he has barely
599
00:36:25,722 --> 00:36:29,472
any protection. He's got a plastic doghouse. One year we
600
00:36:29,496 --> 00:36:32,472
documented he had no straw in his doghouse.
601
00:36:32,576 --> 00:36:36,312
So we're still fighting. We have a sanctuary. The wild animal
602
00:36:36,336 --> 00:36:40,336
sanctuary in Colorado will take him free of charge. We'll do the transport.
603
00:36:40,408 --> 00:36:43,416
They'll do the transport. There'll be no charge to Cook county.
604
00:36:43,568 --> 00:36:46,800
But again, they're not letting him go. So that's.
605
00:36:46,840 --> 00:36:51,448
I just wanted to mention that campaign, and it's another very sad situation.
606
00:36:51,624 --> 00:36:55,344
Thank you. Thank you for making people aware of all of these things, because a
607
00:36:55,352 --> 00:36:59,064
lot of times we're not aware of them. Patrick and I always talk about confinement
608
00:36:59,112 --> 00:37:01,436
being one of the worst cruelties. Yes.
609
00:37:01,588 --> 00:37:05,132
Imagine. Imagine if one, if you at
610
00:37:05,156 --> 00:37:09,140
home listening or you or I are just in a closet
611
00:37:09,180 --> 00:37:12,404
for 23 hours a day. You know, we did nothing wrong,
612
00:37:12,452 --> 00:37:16,356
nothing to deserve that, and the animals did nothing to deserve this. And especially
613
00:37:16,508 --> 00:37:20,340
there is a safe haven for them. There is sanctuaries and rescue
614
00:37:20,380 --> 00:37:23,920
groups that can make these animals lives better.
615
00:37:24,700 --> 00:37:28,796
Spur has been in this display case for more than 30 years.
616
00:37:28,908 --> 00:37:32,436
That's awful. And she has, it's a pet store,
617
00:37:32,468 --> 00:37:35,908
so they play. They play like rock and roll. Now, I'm a
618
00:37:35,924 --> 00:37:39,932
huge rock and roller, but she's a tortoise. And all she
619
00:37:39,956 --> 00:37:43,212
has is, like rock and roll and artificial light. Twenty four seven.
620
00:37:43,396 --> 00:37:46,692
And what is her life expectancy? She can live up to
621
00:37:46,716 --> 00:37:50,652
100 years, give or take. And we believe her age is around 40.
622
00:37:50,796 --> 00:37:54,336
So if nothing is done, she could language in this
623
00:37:54,368 --> 00:37:58,180
cage for another 60 years, give or take. It's awful.
624
00:37:58,720 --> 00:38:02,616
And these are hard stories to listen to, and. But we
625
00:38:02,648 --> 00:38:06,176
want people to remember that it's important to fight for
626
00:38:06,208 --> 00:38:09,208
these animals and to not just give up or throw your hands up.
627
00:38:09,264 --> 00:38:12,936
We are all disgusted with humanity time and again
628
00:38:13,048 --> 00:38:17,112
because of the suffering that animals go through. Which leads me
629
00:38:17,176 --> 00:38:20,808
to my next question. It's a weird segue for it, but it's a
630
00:38:20,824 --> 00:38:24,850
little bit inspiring. Our mission for this podcast is to educate
631
00:38:24,890 --> 00:38:28,546
people about animal issues, to inspire people to fight
632
00:38:28,578 --> 00:38:31,394
for animals. And even though it's hard, heartbreaking work.
633
00:38:31,482 --> 00:38:34,790
So we like to ask each one of our guests this
634
00:38:35,530 --> 00:38:39,210
what do you do? We like to talk about balance. So what do you
635
00:38:39,250 --> 00:38:42,510
do, and how do you balance your life with activism?
636
00:38:42,810 --> 00:38:46,114
What do you do for fun? How do you take breaks? And how do you,
637
00:38:46,162 --> 00:38:49,376
most importantly, avoid? Burnouthen a
638
00:38:49,408 --> 00:38:52,656
great question. Well, if you're friends with me on
639
00:38:52,688 --> 00:38:56,136
Facebook, you probably know I love rock and roll. I know a little
640
00:38:56,168 --> 00:38:59,432
bit about you. But I actually don't make
641
00:38:59,456 --> 00:39:03,152
a lot of money. But I win a lot of concert tickets because I
642
00:39:03,176 --> 00:39:06,400
try. And if I don't win them, I usually
643
00:39:06,440 --> 00:39:09,460
buy the cheapest ticket. But music,
644
00:39:10,000 --> 00:39:13,128
it's not just rock and roll, actually. I love all kinds of music.
645
00:39:13,264 --> 00:39:16,522
I love the theater. I love show tunes. I go.
646
00:39:16,586 --> 00:39:19,874
So I go to concerts and I go. I go to a lot of musicals
647
00:39:19,922 --> 00:39:23,722
with my mom. That's our thing together. And it
648
00:39:23,746 --> 00:39:27,330
makes me happy. It takes me away from the suffering, away from the thinking
649
00:39:27,370 --> 00:39:30,970
about the suffering. But, I mean, my life is dedicated
650
00:39:31,010 --> 00:39:34,474
to the animals. I will always go to a rock concert
651
00:39:34,562 --> 00:39:38,218
or do things on my free time because
652
00:39:38,314 --> 00:39:40,630
I do not want to get burned out. And.
653
00:39:41,820 --> 00:39:44,956
And if you are listening and you're an activist,
654
00:39:45,108 --> 00:39:48,316
I want to say one thing. Some things people will say is, oh, I can't
655
00:39:48,348 --> 00:39:51,548
look at that. I can't read about that. I can't listen to that because I'll
656
00:39:51,564 --> 00:39:55,012
just think about it forever. And I get that because I
657
00:39:55,036 --> 00:39:58,228
remember when I first got involved in
658
00:39:58,244 --> 00:40:01,524
the movement, there were certain things, well, many things,
659
00:40:01,572 --> 00:40:04,852
but a couple of things where I could not stop thinking about it when I
660
00:40:04,876 --> 00:40:08,770
first learned about this kind of suffering. But I will tell you,
661
00:40:08,890 --> 00:40:12,266
the more you learn about it
662
00:40:12,418 --> 00:40:15,786
and the more you take action, the stronger you will become,
663
00:40:15,898 --> 00:40:19,898
because a lot of people feel helpless and hopeless
664
00:40:19,954 --> 00:40:23,826
about these issues. But when you take action, you don't.
665
00:40:23,938 --> 00:40:27,790
That feeling of hopelessness and helplessness
666
00:40:28,250 --> 00:40:31,510
starts to fade away. So again,
667
00:40:32,050 --> 00:40:36,246
that 1 minute action, whether no matter
668
00:40:36,438 --> 00:40:39,870
what your cause is, I mean, they're whatever you want to fight for.
669
00:40:39,990 --> 00:40:43,038
And even if it's not animals, I mean, if you are fighting for the environment
670
00:40:43,134 --> 00:40:46,910
or LGBTQ or, you know, whatever issue,
671
00:40:47,070 --> 00:40:50,326
if you take a little action every day, that will make
672
00:40:50,358 --> 00:40:53,598
you feel more stronger.
673
00:40:53,694 --> 00:40:56,926
Yes. Empowering. Yes. It's empowering, yes. And so
674
00:40:56,958 --> 00:41:00,544
I urge everybody to do that because doing
675
00:41:00,592 --> 00:41:04,256
nothing will definitely not help, and complaining will definitely not
676
00:41:04,288 --> 00:41:07,648
help. So one thing
677
00:41:07,664 --> 00:41:11,152
that bothers me, and everybody can complain and vent. I do all the
678
00:41:11,176 --> 00:41:14,408
time. But if you're going to vent, do action, too,
679
00:41:14,504 --> 00:41:17,200
because taking action helps.
680
00:41:17,280 --> 00:41:20,376
Complaining doesn't. I'm not saying we shouldn't
681
00:41:20,408 --> 00:41:23,696
vent and get it all out, but at least try to take action
682
00:41:23,808 --> 00:41:27,186
once a day for the cause. That's that you're passionate
683
00:41:27,218 --> 00:41:30,482
about. Yeah. And it is empowering. And it feels good. It feels good to make
684
00:41:30,506 --> 00:41:34,530
those phone calls. It feels good to stand with a protest sign. It feels
685
00:41:34,570 --> 00:41:38,362
good to be active in doing something because you know you're
686
00:41:38,386 --> 00:41:41,170
doing something. We feel helpless, we feel hopeless,
687
00:41:41,330 --> 00:41:44,738
but we know. Um, so thank you for that. And I think it's so important
688
00:41:44,794 --> 00:41:47,986
for people to not get burned out. And I think that's why we're kind
689
00:41:48,018 --> 00:41:51,810
of taking that head on as we're trying to inspire people
690
00:41:51,850 --> 00:41:55,570
to be active. We want them to know, you know, there's ways
691
00:41:55,610 --> 00:41:59,314
to get away from it, too. You know, you don't have to watch slaughter
692
00:41:59,362 --> 00:42:02,866
videos over and over and over. Once you know, you know, then just work
693
00:42:02,898 --> 00:42:06,274
to end it. Right, right. And, uh, most of my
694
00:42:06,322 --> 00:42:09,986
daas are not, they don't show a lot of
695
00:42:10,178 --> 00:42:13,778
gratuitous cruelty. And then you don't ever have to
696
00:42:13,794 --> 00:42:17,666
click on anything. I mean, again, sometimes we'll say, please share this video
697
00:42:17,818 --> 00:42:21,018
and you can copy and paste the link, but you don't have to watch it
698
00:42:21,034 --> 00:42:24,490
yourself. And I want to say this before we, I don't want to forget.
699
00:42:24,530 --> 00:42:28,310
It is when we worked on our campaign in Chicago,
700
00:42:29,170 --> 00:42:32,218
I think I mentioned we all worked full time. There were
701
00:42:32,274 --> 00:42:35,626
only when we started, the DAA is maybe a handful
702
00:42:35,658 --> 00:42:38,990
of people doing maybe five at the most.
703
00:42:39,290 --> 00:42:42,562
And I had three other women, I want to mention them.
704
00:42:42,626 --> 00:42:45,514
Barbara, Paula,
705
00:42:45,642 --> 00:42:49,884
and Claudia were my three main activists.
706
00:42:49,932 --> 00:42:53,412
I had others who helped, you know, who came to our protests and educational
707
00:42:53,436 --> 00:42:57,548
outreach, but the main people who worked on it regularly
708
00:42:57,604 --> 00:43:01,156
with documenting violations, testifying before city
709
00:43:01,188 --> 00:43:05,044
council, were four people. So you don't
710
00:43:05,092 --> 00:43:08,380
need the strength of a major animal rights
711
00:43:08,420 --> 00:43:11,572
organization to get these grassroots campaigns
712
00:43:11,596 --> 00:43:15,022
done. You can win them. We won in two and a half years
713
00:43:15,126 --> 00:43:18,294
with four main people doing the big,
714
00:43:18,422 --> 00:43:21,878
like, the heavy lifting. In a sense. We had, again, we had people come to
715
00:43:21,894 --> 00:43:25,206
outreach. We had people do the daas. But you can do it
716
00:43:25,278 --> 00:43:28,646
with a few people. Two people can do this. Yes. And I'm
717
00:43:28,678 --> 00:43:31,966
certain of that? Yes. I love your passion, your dedication,
718
00:43:32,078 --> 00:43:35,614
and your, you just, you keep going and you
719
00:43:35,622 --> 00:43:38,622
go to the rock concerts in between. And you. I do see a lot on
720
00:43:38,646 --> 00:43:42,452
Facebook that you win tickets. I'm going to have to because you make
721
00:43:42,476 --> 00:43:46,268
the call. See, you can making
722
00:43:46,324 --> 00:43:49,996
calls. You win tickets. You're relentless. And making calls, you can end animal exploitation.
723
00:43:50,068 --> 00:43:54,508
So in the last month, I have had two,
724
00:43:54,684 --> 00:43:58,212
my boyfriend and another friend win tickets because I couldn't.
725
00:43:58,356 --> 00:44:01,732
And, excuse me, I said call,
726
00:44:01,876 --> 00:44:05,316
and they did. And they won. And they won't say all the time. They're like,
727
00:44:05,388 --> 00:44:08,512
you're so lucky. Of course you won. And I'm like, when was the
728
00:44:08,536 --> 00:44:11,768
last time you called? But that's the thing.
729
00:44:11,824 --> 00:44:16,016
It's kind of like activism. Don't do it. If you don't try, you can't
730
00:44:16,048 --> 00:44:18,540
do it. Right. It won't happen. Exactly. Exactly.
731
00:44:19,720 --> 00:44:22,792
So I'm sure we're going to have you back. Jody, thank you so much.
732
00:44:22,816 --> 00:44:26,624
This was a great conversation. We'll have links to whatever,
733
00:44:26,712 --> 00:44:29,624
everything we talked about and whatever else you'd like to add. We'll put that in
734
00:44:29,632 --> 00:44:33,104
the show notes for everyone to see. And thank you
735
00:44:33,152 --> 00:44:35,840
so much for being here. And thank you so much for all you do for
736
00:44:35,880 --> 00:44:39,940
animals. Thank you. And thank you for everything you do. And Patrick
737
00:44:39,980 --> 00:44:43,308
and horse racing rungs does. I help you as much as
738
00:44:43,324 --> 00:44:47,060
I can. And I'll be there with you, too, until we ban
739
00:44:47,100 --> 00:44:50,148
horse racing around the world. One team for the animals,
740
00:44:50,204 --> 00:44:53,084
right? That's right. Thank you so much.
741
00:44:53,252 --> 00:44:57,060
You know, that's important, too, is, you know, work with, even if you don't like
742
00:44:57,100 --> 00:45:00,108
someone, work with them because you're not doing it for them, you're doing it for
743
00:45:00,124 --> 00:45:03,884
the animals. Yes. Yes. Always put those personal things aside and just
744
00:45:03,972 --> 00:45:08,280
stay focused. And that's how we help animals every single day.
745
00:45:08,460 --> 00:45:11,860
So thank you so much. Thank you very much.
746
00:45:14,400 --> 00:45:18,216
Hey, Nicole, here from in behalf of animals.
747
00:45:18,368 --> 00:45:22,256
We hope you love our show as much as you love animals.
748
00:45:22,368 --> 00:45:25,952
And if you do, can you take a quick action to help amplify their
749
00:45:25,976 --> 00:45:29,336
voices? Simply follow our podcast and write us
750
00:45:29,368 --> 00:45:32,272
a five star review on Apple Podcasts,
751
00:45:32,376 --> 00:45:35,362
Spotify and wherever you are listening right now.
752
00:45:35,506 --> 00:45:39,362
It helps new listeners discover the show to learn more about how
753
00:45:39,426 --> 00:45:42,418
they can join our community and help animals,
754
00:45:42,474 --> 00:45:45,946
too. Thank you for listening and remember to be their
755
00:45:45,978 --> 00:45:48,350
voice every chance you get.
